Friday, October 5, 2007

I just want a chance to see my son's girls

I had a tear in my eye after I read this . RIP mum killed by a hateful Family Court and a sinister New Zealand Police Force !!! Well done psychologist Dr John Watson and barrister Adrienne Edwards ( I hope you are happy mum is dead as you murdered her ). I first alerted the Prime Minister of New Zealand Helen Clark of my terrible family circustances early in 2002. She fobbed me off , and I am thankful for the support of various National Party MP's including Don Brash , John Key , Nick Smith and Judith Collins . I would also like to thank the sincere lady Muriel Newman who was most compassionate at a Select Committee Hearing relating to the Care of Children Bill.
Thank you Muriel and I hope you are well. I will never forget the Chairman of Select Committee Tim Barnett laughing at my sad situation . I will get even , legally .

Anyway here is the touching article from Scotland .

I just want chance to see my son's girls


HEARTBROKEN and grieving, there was just one thing that kept Ann Ramsay going after the suicide of her only son - an overwhelming love for his two beautiful children.

One was just six years old and the spitting image of Ann's own daughter; the other was two years younger, delicate and dainty with a shock of blonde curls. They are Ann's last mortal link with the son she had to bury, aged just 24.

If only she had her way, she'd spend as much time as possible with the children. There would be trips to the park, fun sleepovers and granny's home cooking.

But instead, a bitter rift has blown Ann's world apart - the little girls she dotes on as only a granny can are no longer permitted to visit her home. The few times she has seen them recently have been by accident when she's spotted them in the street in the Midlothian village where they all live.

"It's been terrible, really horrible," says Ann, reflecting on how a tragic sequence of events and a painful period of grief culminated in a rift with the girls' mother, heralding a shattering severing of family ties.

"So much has happened," says Ann. "My son hanged himself just three weeks after my father died; his partner started a relationship with one of his close friends; I struggled to cope with it all.

"I'm the first one to admit my head was all over the place, but not to have the chance to see the girls . . . it's just tearing me apart."

It's a tragic tale of a family ripped asunder by highly charged emotions, petty squabbles and stubborn attitudes, with two innocent little girls caught in the crossfire. Sad as it is, Ann's heartbreak at being denied the chance to cuddle and care for her grandchildren is not unusual.

On Tuesday, campaigners Grandparents Apart Self-Help Group took their 277-signature petition to the Scottish Parliament's justice committee to ask for the greater legal rights for grandparents struggling to gain access to grandchildren. Led by Jimmy Deuchars, they pleaded for an advisory Charter for Grandchildren - drawn up to secure grandparents' access to children in the face of family breakdowns and disputes - to become legally binding.

It would mean, argues the group, that grandparents could not simply be frozen out of their grandchildren's lives on a parental whim; and that grandparents such as Ann - sidelined as her son's partner moves on with her life and cut from her two grandchildren's lives - might have at least some legal rights.

Ann's voice catches as she counts, on one hand, the number of times she has seen her son's pretty little daughters in the past two years - just twice last year and just once this year for only ten minutes.

A sympathetic family friend sneaked the girls to her home and hid them behind the wheelie bins in the garden so that they wouldn't be spotted.

"I just want the chance to spend time with them," Ann explains, "because they are all I have left of my laddie."

Her son Robert's lifeless body was found hanging from a tree in July 2004, just a few weeks after a split from his partner - the mother of his two little girls.

Says Ann: "He had been trying to get in touch with his ex-partner. He'd had a difficult time with cocaine - but he'd been trying to sort himself out and hadn't touched drugs for nearly a year.

"The break-up came out of the blue and he took it very badly because he really loved his children. Three weeks before his suicide my dad died - and there'd been family problems there too.

"It was the anniversary of Robert's dad's death from a heart attack. He was really finding it hard to cope.

"He went back on the drugs, went out on the Friday night and never came back. He hanged himself." Tormented by her grief, Ann admits that she made mistakes in the months that followed her son's death.

She buried her feelings in a bottle, raged against her highly charged emotions and sobbed herself to sleep at night. With her only other child, her daughter, living in Wales and with no other grandchildren to focus on, Ann poured her emotions into the wellbeing of Robert's little girls.

Today she can understand why his partner lashed out at her, angrily warning her that she'd never see her grandchildren again after social workers arrived at her home to check on their welfare.

"I really believe she is a good mother and that the girls are well cared for," says Ann.

"I like their mother - I've got a lot of time for her and I know she has had a lot of emotional upset too. I know I've not been an angel in all of this.

"I've sent her a letter and I've tried to make contact to sort it out, but I can't get near her.

"All I want now is to have the chance to spend a bit of time with the girls - they're all I have of Robert and not being with them has been horrendous."

But petty squabbles can rapidly evolve into major family rows capable of tearing apart relationships - as Sandra Docherty from West Lothian knows only too well.

She describes the row she had with her daughter as a "minor tiff" - so irrelevant that she can't even remember what it was about - but still severe enough to have led to her being frozen from her grandchildren's lives for seven years.

"I used to look after my granddaughters all the time so my daughter and her husband could go out to work," explains Sandra, 67. "What started as a tiff spiralled out of control, I tried to patch things up, but then we both ended up digging our heels in.

"I asked to see the children, she said no and after a year I decided to go to court."

It was then that Sandra discovered that grandparents have no legal access rights to their grandchildren.

She lost not only the case, but the impact of going to court created a new division. Today, neither her son nor her daughter speaks to her and she hasn't seen her two granddaughters - nor been allowed to send them a birthday card or Christmas present - in seven years.

"I can only hope that one day the girls might turn up on my doorstep. At least then I can show them all the court papers and tell them that I only wanted to be given a chance to spend time with them, that I really love them," says Sandra.

"I know I could never have put my parents through what my daughter has put me through.

"I didn't get a card from her for my 60th birthday. Instead I got a solicitor's letter from her saying I wasn't going to get to see the girls again.

"She's 37 now, and I don't think she's going to change her mind. But if she turned up at my door tomorrow, I'd let her in and I'd forgive her.

"Whatever has happened, she's still my daughter."

HELP group Grandparents Apart was formed six years ago by a group of grandparents fighting for the right of access to their grandchildren.

The aim was to provide support and advice, but more recently the group has lobbied the Scottish Parliament, calling for a change in family law to give greater rights to grandparents.

Organised by Jimmy Deuchars, from Mosspark in Glasgow, the petition calls for MSPs to change the advisory Charter for Grandchildren to make it legally binding to ensure "the rights of children are recognised by all public agencies and families, and enforced by law".

He argues that the advisory charter has been ineffective in providing grandparents with greater access to their grandchildren in the wake of family disputes.

He has personal experience of how few rights grandparents have after becoming embroiled in his own battle to see his granddaughters following their mother's death from breast cancer and their father's decision to move to Liverpool.

"It started to become harder and harder to actually see the girls," he explained.

"There were always excuses why they couldn't get to Carlisle - where we had agreed to meet. We ended up going to court in Liverpool to try to sort it out and it was shocking at first to find out that as grandparents you really don't have any rights at all."

Mr Deuchars and his wife Margaret argued their case for access with a court reporter, and eventually an amicable agreement was reached between their former son-in-law and his new wife.

Now he is determined to help other grandparents in their fight for access.

"Grandparents have a lot to offer a family yet they don't have any rights whatsoever," he said. "That's wrong. It's painful for children to lose contact as much as it hurts grandparents.

"It's all about getting families together and trying to make sure the children in the middle don't lose out."

This article:


Anonymous said...


I really want to understand your position. You support fathers' rights - but rights come with responsibility depending on the context.

So a couple of questions:

When a husband and wife have a violent relationship, do you think the children should continue to live under the same roof?

Does your answer change if the violence is inflicted on the children?

When a husband and wife separate, do you favour custody sharing?

But what if the custody sharing puts a child in contact with a parent who inflicted violence on him/her?

dad4justice said...

1. I believe children should not have to witness violence in any form including psychological abuse in any form .

2. The cause of the violence must be determined so it can be fixed .

3. 50/50 shared custody after separation only in circustances where absolutely no chance of violence to the children can be guaranteed by both parents .

4. In NO circustances should any children be put in a position where they are subjected to violence .

Kind regards d4j

Anonymous said...

Thanks for your considered response.

Now, to take matters further, do you agree that fathers are (statistically speaking) more likely to be abusive than mothers? I'm not talking about the general population here. I'm talking about the much smaller abusive population.

If you agree, then this might explain why the system is more likely to place children under the mother's custody.

But I understand your story is slightly different: mothers who intend to separate for whatever reason, and invent stories of abuse to ensure that they are granted sole custody.

By the way, I'm "Peak Oil Conspiracy" on Kiwiblog, and just want to say that we can actually have a sensible conversation. It's just that you have to be more respectful of my views and stop hauling abuse.

dad4justice said...

Peak the cut and paste queen oil , always looking at backstabbing me on kiwiblog .Anybody would think it was a conspiracy to undermine my credibility? Who cares ? Whats your real name ? Anyway don't give me static twisted one .

Studies from Canterbury and Otago Universities indicate that domestic violence is attributable to both genders, with both genders as guilty as each other , however I will agree a small percentage of fathers spoil it for the majority .

The de family court is a tool for the sick feminist cult that is affecting NZ at present and the corrupt judges give custody to mothers even though they unfit mothers . My children are ruined by the system !!!!!!!!!!

The bias court kills many innocent and alienated heartbroken paternal parents and elderly gran parents go to the grave unable to cope with the vicious treatment of their children . Try being a respondent in the family court . Its great fun as you can beaten to a pulp in Greymouth , Ashburton and Christchurch Central Police Stations !!!

We must stop the pernicious feminarcissist lie that mothers have the monopoly on loving their children, that mothers are the supreme parents. Society's ills
can be traced to the LACK of fathers living with their children. Think Lindsay Lohan. Think Britney Spears.

Anonymous said...


I don't necessarily agree with the the way you express yourself - seriosuly, words like "feminarcissist" really don't help you to get the message across. But we both agree that the system shouldn't place children with mothers (or fathers) who are unsuitable parents.

The problem is: how do you devise a system that fairly gets evidence before the court, when the family court is a classic "he says, she says" scenario? What would you have the judge do?

dad4justice said...

Right fair question ;

Now as soon as a dv incident is reported the man is assumed the perpetrator of all the problems . There are already women victim and children support mechanisms in place to assist the often volatile situation . The man is taken by police . This is where I come . I find out the truthful family composition and interactions and all the triggers that caused the situation . I have written report ready to put in front of judge within 21 days . No problem . No lawyers and no psychologists !!
The money made from professionals in my case since 2001 must be staggering . Tax payer funded - millions ?? !!

My idea is to co -ordinate with present authorities and concentrating on the father accepting his moral obligation to his family as a responsible dad to his children . Early intervention .
No false allegations . No lies that just keep running in the litigation world of the family court adversarial system where whoever has got the most money usually wins . Kids are not trophies !!

The system throw these guys in jail so they are history . These guys have no chance to express the other side of the story . A meeting of the minds asap after the incident would benefit society enormously .

When these guys get out their families are gone and they ain't too much to lose , so they re offend . The support mechanisms for these guys is nil .

My idea would save the country millions . Think early intervention that is not tied up in a political ideology !! Think no stress for kids .Keep it simple - no bullshit or tricky business . Kids deserve truth , honesty , integrity , grace and love .

Anonymous said...

You make some interesting points. Thanks for setting out your views. I'll reflect on them and come back to you.